Air Travel Statistics

Discussion in 'Aviation Passenger Security in the USA' started by esgatch, Dec 23, 2012.

  1. esgatch

    esgatch Member

    I read recently that Commercial Aviation in the U.S.A. has LOST one-million travelers every year for the last 4 years, but I don't remember the source for that. Has anyone seen that reported anywhere?
     
  2. RB

    RB Founding Member

    I don't have a reference but AA airline over the last few months reduced available seats monthly by 2-4% each month over a 3 month period. That certainly does not support any signs of increased carrier passenger load.

    Being treated like cattle by the airlines, abusive add-on fees, and the assault on travelers by TSA has made many turn to other methods of travel. Trains are running full as a result and many others are driving when ever possible.
     
  3. esgatch

    esgatch Member

    The report I read also said that commercial airlines have 'parked' a substantial amount of their airplanes, reduced flights, and added new fees.
     
  4. Doober

    Doober Original Member

    That is essentially true as the airlines have been putting large aircraft in storage and pulling out smaller aircraft, which is why they can report that flights are full. They are trying to pull the wool over the eyes of the flying public and possibly their investors.
     
  5. esgatch

    esgatch Member

    Airlines are required by the FAA to implement rigorous maintenance and safety protocols when they indefinitely park their airplanes. It will still cost the Airlines a ton of money when they do that.
     
  6. RB

    RB Founding Member

    Can you cite the FAR that states what these maintenance requirements are?
     
  7. nachtnebel

    nachtnebel Original Member

    good point. also payments for those aircraft are still required, or even if paid off, there's a loss of ROI that should have been there, which has impact on the bottom line. F*k them all. Their fault for not sticking up for their passengers when TSA started strip searching them and sexually molesting them in 2010. I hope they all go bankrupt.
     
    Wimpie likes this.
  8. RB

    RB Founding Member

    Other than Southwest they pretty much all have.
     
  9. esgatch

    esgatch Member

    I could find out. I have friends & family in the industry. I know they're very specific and quite comprehensive, depending on the amount of time an aircraft has been out of service.
     
  10. RB

    RB Founding Member

    I have an A&P although I don't work in the industry any longer. I don't recall ever reading about storage requirements but doesn't make it not so.
     
  11. esgatch

    esgatch Member

    I have friend who is current on his A&P, worked for a major Airline. I remember him mentioning their maintenance schedules. He basically said the longer they sit, the more it costs to return them to full-time service.
     
  12. RB

    RB Founding Member

    I would agree with it taking more time to return a plane from a period of being idle. All maintenance checks would have to be pulled.

    Here is a link to the number of jets in storage. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...-term-commercial-aircraft-storage-table-.html

    The few times I put an airplane into moth balls while in the Navy we basically sprayed a light oil into the engines while spinning (not started), made sure all static and other openings were plugged, serviced all oil, hydraulic systems and accumulators. Also defueled the tanks to reduce weight and stress on the wing roots. This type of preservation was good enough for a few months. I never personally did any for long term storage so only know the airplanes go through a process of applying a protective cocoon and controlling the humidity in the cabin. This is the kind of storage process seen at places like the bone yards in the desert.

    A list of some bone yards.

    http://www.johnweeks.com/boneyard/
     
  13. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    One thing you have to remember is that when a plane is NOT parked, its major expense is fuel, not amortization and maintenance. The current push in the airline industry is to carry more passengers with fewer planes.

    DOT used to publish a monthly Air Travel Consumer Report, which was an invaluable source of information on enplanements, complaints, tarmac delays, etc., for major U.S. airlines. Unfortunately that seems to have ceased at the start of FY 2013 -- the last one is dated September, 2012.

    As as was going through the 2012 figures a few days ago, 2012 enplanements did appear to be significantly higher than in 2011, but otherwise, yes, the airline industry has been very depressed the last few years.

    Meanwhile, Amtrak has been reporting record ridership levels year after year for almost 10 years, and automobile traffic keeps increasing. Intercity bus services with some amenities (e.g. internet) are also springing up.

    Between being molested by the Gropenmenschen and being packed into aluminum cigar tubes like sardine, it's pretty clear that Americans have lost any great love that they had for air travel.
     
  14. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    It's the business model started by Delta and it's worked well for them -- keep loads high and park unnecessary aircraft in the interim. Delta itself hasn't been parking very many lately, and they're in the process of acquiring AirTran's 717's.

    It has nothing to do with reporting full flights. The goal is to reduce the cost per passenger as much as possible and squeeze every last penny of profit out of their network. Planes that are flying are full; planes that aren't full are parked.

    Except that they're not pulling out smaller aircraft. Delta's been dumping lots of 50-seaters, and they shut down Comair in September.

    The problem will come when loads drop and they keep shrinking their fleets to keep the loads up. Eventually some of these airlines will shrink to nothing.
     
  15. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Welcome to TUG, esgatch!
     
  16. N965VJ

    N965VJ Original Member

    I was playing around with a radio app on my phone about a month ago and came across an analyst on Bloomberg Business thinking out loud that the airlines must be doing really well because whenever he flies, his plane is full. :rolleyes: I wish I made a note of who he was.
     
  17. Frank

    Frank Original Member

    Some of it is storage requirements, a lot of it is what you have to do to bring it back in service dependent on the amount of time in storage.
     
  18. Frank

    Frank Original Member

    We'll see what happens when the freedom fluffers start showing up at major train stations.
     
  19. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Mystery solved!

    Current reports are under a different domain name: www.dot.gov/airconsumer/

    Old reports are where they always were, with no cross-reference to the new site: http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/reports/index.htm
     
  20. Fisher1949

    Fisher1949 Original Member Coach

    It's way more than than that. I calculated an average decline of 4% per year since 2009 in a post at TSA News last year.

    Check the passenger stats from FAA. There is a dialog box at the bottom of the page to select the year or change the 2012 at the end of the URL to the year wanted.
    http://www.faa.gov/airports/planning_capacity/passenger_allcargo_stats/passenger/index.cfm?year=2012
     

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