My Travel Plan (Being Prepared Not to Fly)

Discussion in 'Aviation Passenger Security in the USA' started by phoebepontiac, Aug 11, 2011.

  1. nachtnebel

    nachtnebel Original Member

    why not? is it a cursory old style patdown or is it the full monty? Boggie dog said he saw people getting the full feel-over. after they've been cleared.

    you know, if this is random, just use dogs! They are showing us they can crotch feel us any time they want. This is pure terrorism against passengers.
    DeafBlonde, Lisa Simeone and KrazyKat like this.
  2. KrazyKat

    KrazyKat Original Member

    I'm astonished--(okay it's taken a bit for these reports to sink in, cut me some slack here)--because by their own process of checking and clearing it makes no Golf Delta sense. Other than, of course, pure terrorism. I think it's a huge mistake to blithely see this as the same as the initial security screening, even if the checkpoint screening is objectionable.
    What possible rationale has been given for random feel-ups of passengers who have already cleared security? There's obviously no anomaly that's being checked for. Duh. I know, pure terrorism...
  3. Leave no trace

    Leave no trace Original Member

    I am a Brit' who has immigrated to Canada. During the few years before and just after 9/11, I was investigating the options of immigrating to the USA.
    Clearly I did not make the move to the US, after reading this, you may understand why.

    In the distant past I have really enjoyed visiting America. I have been travelling to the US as a tourist and business visitor for over 40 years.
    During these years I have ridden to all the mainland states by motorcycle (my bike "lives" at a friends place in Idaho), it has been fantastic, the people that I met on my travels have been wonderful.
    These people have offered friendship, humor, openness and hospitality; the list of our shared stories are endless.
    Now, after all the government lies and deceit, I won't fly to the US or even fly through it. My numerous friends in the USA know my reasons and respect my choice.
    It is now quite a rare occurrence for me to visit my friends, the distances that I have to travel are prohibitive.

    It is really sad that the land of the free, is now run by dictators who employ idiots and perverts, none of them give a damn about real people.
    In Europe we have seen this before, we all fought against this evil in global wars and now it comes to this... in America !

    The saddest part in this, is there are very few Americans who are attempting to fight right now against these abuses of assumed power.
    Americans have lost the spark of patriotism that I have marvelled at so regularly in the past.
    The united States of America has become fat, lazy, selfish and arrogant; It behaves like this at home and on the world stage, clearly it is no longer United.
    Today, the true heros in the USA are those who know what they have already lost and what is at stake right now, I salute them.

    Everyone else should be ashamed of their inaction.

    One day in the not to distant future, there will be signs erected by heros in hometown America, they will read...

    "Rest in peace, USA".
    Lisa Simeone likes this.
  4. KrazyKat

    KrazyKat Original Member

    I am looking for another country for my son to go to college in.
    Sounds like a good yard sign.:(
  5. Fisher1949

    Fisher1949 Original Member Coach

    There is a adage in business that says "if you're not willing to walk away from the table you're not negotiating" that easily applies in the checkpoint situation.

    It infuriates me when I read an account by a victim of a checkpoint or back room assault and they qualify their participation by saying something to the effect of " I was late for my flight and had to go along" or "I really needed to make my meeting/vacation/family event, etc. so I couldn't resist" or the least acceptable "It would have cost a few hundred dollars to rebook my flight." If the rebooking fee is the argument then the passenger placed the price of their dignity at a few hundred dollars.

    The victims in these cases are often also victims of their own failure to plan or stand their ground. There have been many folks who have resisted and been escorted out of the airport, no fine (which I think is a bluff), no charges, just sent out of the facility. The woman who screamed after the Sky harbor assault is an example:

    After decades of heavy travel I can guarantee that there is always another flight, either from the same airport or the next nearest facility. Missing a flight is not the end of the world and sometimes can work out to the travelers advantage, e.g. a less crowded later flight, free upgrade to keep the fare and so forth. There have been many reports where airlines have rebooked passengers who had a TSA problem at no charge. They likely don't want to be caught up in the bad PR when the passengers tells others their story.

    If there is a time sensitive event at the destination, simply leave a day early to provide leeway should a problem arise and have a backup itinerary planned. If there is a problem at the checkpoint, simply refuse to consent and tell the screener that you refuse to be touched and are leaving the checkpoint. They can't detain you or prevent you from walking out although they willing likely summon police to escort you and your bags to curbside. At most you risk a disorderly conduct charge by the police which in most jurisdictions amounts to a traffic ticket and which very likely will be dismissed by a court.

    It generally sounds as though you plan is well formulated and the odds are that everything will go smoothly. Based on anecdotal evidence,airports with scanners tend to have a higher frequency of pat downs.

    Good luck and let everyone know how it went.

    [Coached by Mike to embed video]
    Lisa Simeone and KrazyKat like this.
  6. Cartoon Peril

    Cartoon Peril Original Member

    Not sure why that should necessarily be so however, not that I accept any of the current regime. It seems like there has to be some sort of fail safe.
  7. Thanks for the discussion, everybody.

    I'm still thinking about the gate gropes, haven't decided what to do. I read most of the FT thread on the subject, and I'm confident that I would just plain refuse if they wanted to grope the kids at the gate. But if it's me they would want to grope, I could take the opportunity to be troublesome. I could demand fresh gloves, a fresh swab, a LEO or airline witness, a private screening, and someone to chaperone the kids while I'm being groped, because they certainly shouldn't view something so untoward as their mother's body being desecrated (wouldn't it be cool if I actually said that?). I could take charge of the situation and make it extremely difficult for them, and then see what happens. And I think I could do this all with the vibe of just a bossy lady, not as somebody trying to challenge the system.

    Or, I could refuse and see if they walk us out of the airport. Don't know, still thinking about it.

    And also, I think I'll probably be just fine and will breeze through security. I tend to put off a "these aren't the droids you're looking for" kind of vibe. I pretty much never get messed with, and have walked down some shady dark alleys in my day.
    Cartoon Peril likes this.
  8. Cartoon Peril

    Cartoon Peril Original Member

    The Force has a powerful effect on weak minds.

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