TSA cordons 300' perimeter & closes part of DFW terminal for "ammunition"?(turned out to be grenade)

Discussion in 'Aviation Passenger Security in the USA' started by Mike, Mar 12, 2012.

  1. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    All this for "ammunition "?

    MSNBC: TSA Agents Find Ammunition in Bag at DFW Airport

    Any bets that the average Texan has more ammo at home?
     
    KrazyKat likes this.
  2. N965VJ

    N965VJ Original Member

    I hope someone brought along binoculars so they could keep an eye on that bag of ammo from a safe distance. :confused::rolleyes:
     
    Lisa Simeone likes this.
  3. Fisher1949

    Fisher1949 Original Member Coach

    The writer must have written this story on his smart phone.
     
  4. Caradoc

    Caradoc Original Member

    Maybe they were afraid a TSA screener would trip and land on a bullet.
     
    Lisa Simeone likes this.
  5. TravelnMedic

    TravelnMedic Original Member

    It's not going to go off by itself, then again the idiots at TSA would do something stupid to set it off. Sad one depending the caliber/load 300' only gonna give the round ample time to heat up and add to the damage to a smurf.

    Which caliber? Loaded and ready? Or supplies to reload? ...More then enough to take care of a zombie attack and then some!
     
  6. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    If it had been anything really dangerous, methinks they'd already be bragging about their big save of the day. After an hour they just reopen the checkpoint, and then, nada.
     
  7. FaustsAccountant

    FaustsAccountant Original Member

    Now guys, I once saw a Weird Al movie where he caught bullets in his mouth, chewed them up and spat them out like a machine-gun! So I'm SURE that the powers that be blue, considered it was with an abundance of caution to prevent anyone from re-enacting that scene.
     
    Lisa Simeone likes this.
  8. Rugape

    Rugape Original Member

    According to the story, this was a live 40mm round, and while it will not spontaneously detonate under normal circumstances, if there were other items in the bag that could have looked like a firing chain, then it should be cordoned off until the TSSE or local bomb squad can clear it. I will not use the OOAAOC phrase many here like to use and TSA seems to use all the time, but I will say that it is protocol to clear the area if a live explosive is found. If it were bullets, it would be a different situation entirely. 300 ft for a 40mm is a bit further than I have seen in some of the handbooks, but if you have inexpereinced (read folks that have never interacted with them on a regular basis) individuals on scene first, 300 ft is not a bad call.
     
  9. Lisa Simeone

    Lisa Simeone Original Member

    And what happens when somebody brings ammunition, or an explosive, or take-your-pick to the front doors of the airport? Then what? Do we set up the scanners/gropers there and cordon off that area? How about the parking garage? How about the ramp leading up to the airport? After all, can't be too safe!
     
  10. Rugape

    Rugape Original Member

    So, what is your suggestion when a live explosive item is found?
     
  11. Lisa Simeone

    Lisa Simeone Original Member

    I would like to say something but I don't dare put it in writing. I think the regulars here can imagine.
     
  12. Rugape

    Rugape Original Member

    I can imagine as well, but I was looking for a serious response to better understand the objection to the basic response.
     
  13. RB

    RB Founding Member

    A live explosive item. Really???

    How about using just a touch of common sense. Is common ammo really deserving of a 300 foot safety zone? If so I guess my local sporting goods store needs to have yellow tape all around the entire building because they have box upon box of ammunition in the store.

    If TSA or any other security operation finds ammo then control it, move it to a secure place and deal with the situation.

    If we are talking about an explosive item, like the 2 1/2 pounds of C-4 you guys missed late last year, then I would agree that should be handled with more caution and I would also agree that a safety zone be set up until the item is moved to a safe location.

    It seems to me that TSA has only one procedure for this type of thing. Faulty policies as is typical for TSA.
     
  14. Elizabeth Conley

    Elizabeth Conley Original Member

    Unless "live explosive item" is integrated into a device intended to result in inevitable detonation within a brief and finite period of time, dispose of said item promptly and calmly, without histrionics or theater.

    I am not a fan of theatrics or hysteria, particularly on the taxpayer's dime. Theatrics on the part of the TSA which result in generating public anxiety count as calculated acts of terror in my book. I will not tolerate my government sponsoring acts of terror against me and my fellow citizens. If sociopaths in federal employ want to engage in terrorism, they need to get private funding for that and do it on their own time.

    Terrorism is not a legitimate function of the U.S. Federal Government, nor is the production of propaganda aimed at manipulated U.S. citizens.
     
  15. Rugape

    Rugape Original Member

    Last time I checked, a 40mm HE round was considered live explosives. If the people finding the items were unable to determine that it was *not* wired to something to cause it to blow, then I can find no fault in their response, until the TSSE or bomb squad arrived to determine the nature of the item. Yes it has to be interacted with by an outside force, but it is live HE in the shell. Having seen things go wrong with stuff like this before, I am inclined to remove as much of the possibility of something harming the folks (myself included) in the airport as possible.
     
  16. Rugape

    Rugape Original Member

    Agreed with the disposal in as calm and reasonable a fashion as possible, but if you are unable to determine that the item is wired for detonation or is a part of the aforementioned device? What sort of response are you going to suggest then? Please do not mistake this for an attempt at bashing, I am truly trying to understand why cordoning off an area around a live device is a bad thing in a public setting. I have seen what 40mm can do when they go off, it isn't pretty, so common sense (if you are unable to determine whether it is integrated into a device) dictates clearing the area of non-essential personnel.
     
  17. RB

    RB Founding Member

    Any public evidence showing just exactly what was found? If a person had an explosive device don't you think the would detonate the weapon if they have been discovered? A loose round isn't really much of a threat. 40mm rounds are man launched and man carried. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M203_grenade_launcher If they can be safely carried then the threat of premature detonation is remote.

    Face it, TSA has determined that stuff like water, soda, peanut butter, cupcakes and such are to dangerous to move from the unsecured side of the airport to the supposedly secure side of the airport but you guys just toss those dangerous items in common trash bins. Why should I put any more faith in how TSA handles other items, like this item you say was a 40mm round? Those confiscated items are dangerous right? If not why are they being confiscated? Why aren't they treated like dangerous items?

    Any remarks on Jon's video?
     
  18. RB

    RB Founding Member

    Seems West bailed out during the middle of the discussion. Musta been time to go to work and feel up some 74 year old passengers.
     
  19. Rugape

    Rugape Original Member

    Per the original article, it was a 40mm round. If it is in a bag full of other stuff, including wires, other organics and such, then I am not going to mess with it because I do not have the training to safely ascertain that there is no detonation chain in place on it. I carried a 203 for a while, I know the rounds better than most folks that will encounter it, I also know that I do not have enough experience with IEDs in a hands on fashion to clear something like this if it has other stuff around it. You were military for a longer time than I was, I am fairly confident that you know just how easy it is to make an IED out of everyday stuff found in your house, even in a cell phone that you carry, especially if you add a 40mm HE round into the mix. I would rather have the guys that have been trained to assess those items do so, rather than take a chance (even if it is remote) that I could set the bag off digging around in it, to do so, would needlessly endanger myself and others around me.

    No, I have no comment on Jons video.
     
  20. RB

    RB Founding Member

    I wasn't suggesting that you tell us if he got it right. I am more interested in the TSA reaction. Seems based on what is going on with the TSA Blog having stopped posting comments on this topic, the newest puppy post, and with TSA spokespeople sending threatening emails to the media that TSA is trying to steer the conversation to other topics.

    How about on the topic of TSA age discrimination practices? I think that deserves some discussion.
     
    Lisa Simeone likes this.
Tags: DFW grenade

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