Two thumbs up to the governor of Vermont

Discussion in 'What's On Your Mind?' started by Doober, Oct 26, 2011.

  1. Doober

    Doober Original Member

    I get an e-mail letter from America's Test Kitchen, Christopher Kimball. Here's the first paragraph of the most recent letter:

    I'd love to know what might happen if DHS and its VIPR goons showed up in Vermont.
     
  2. DeafBlonde

    DeafBlonde Original Member

    As we say in the South, "Well, bless her heart!" If I lived in Vermont, she'd get my vote when she's up for re-election!

    Do you have any idea where she stands on the Airport Security Searches?
     
  3. Doober

    Doober Original Member

    I can't find anything recent on the plan by several states to fight pat downs as a coalition but I believe I do recall that Vermont was mentioned as being willing to join in the fight.
     
  4. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Unfortunately this might come back to haunt the neighboring landowners months or years later when the feds finally come after them. If I have time to find them, there some appalling stories about what the feds to do people who have altered "wetlands" without permits.
     
  5. Doober

    Doober Original Member

    I don't think federal wetlands permits apply to private or state-owned properties.
     
  6. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Yes, they do. :(
     
  7. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Here's one of the articles ...

    NY Times: Idaho Couple's Permit Fight Drags Wetlands Back to Supreme Court

    And if you don't understand that they (EPA & Corps of Engineers) are in charge and play their games, they will make you "restore" your property before you can apply for a permit to fill it again:


     
  8. Doober

    Doober Original Member

    Let's just say that I'm associated with two organizations that preserve and protect headwaters and help landowners with permitting and I've never known the feds to be involved at all.
     
  9. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    From the attorneys representing the Sacketts in Priest Lake, ID ...

    What the Priest Lake wetland case is REALLY actually about

    Sounds like TSA in the wetlands :td:
     
  10. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Well, obviously you've missed a few things.
     
  11. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    And then there is the case of of the late John Pozsgai in Pennsylvania, an immigrant from Hungary & survivor of the 1956 Hungarian uprising, who tried to clean up a junk yard on his property and ended up in prison ...



    Welcome to Amerika, John. We hope you enjoyed your stay here.
     
  12. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    This is what happened to a guy who tried to rely on local permitting:


    Ironically he was sentenced to prison for for his flood control work (on a creek bed that was dry 10 months of the year) on the same day that the Supreme Court released its Rapanos decision declaring that such occasional waterways are not subject to federal jurisdiction.

    Note, however, that the feds are largely trying to pretend that Rapanos never happened.
     
  13. DeafBlonde

    DeafBlonde Original Member

    Wow, just, WOW! (...or, alternatively, HOLY SH!T!!!) This justifies my fear of Big Government! :eek:
     
  14. nachtnebel

    nachtnebel Original Member

    Up in the Shasta area of northern california, landowners are routinely extorted by federal government in this fashion, intimidated into paying fines for crimes such as clearing out your own irrigation ditches, re-grading your own road through your own pasture. Only until the landowners stop paying and tell them effectively, come get us, have these folks backed off. The feds know the law is not on their side, they're just throwing their weight around.
     
  15. Doober

    Doober Original Member

    "New Jersey joined Michigan in becoming the only two states to be
    delegated regulatory authority over wetlands from the US Environmental
    Protection Agency (US EPA). Both the US EPA and the US Army Corps of
    Engineers (US ACOE) regulate wetlands in all other states...."

    http://www.njpinelandsanddownjersey.com
     
  16. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Congrats to NJ & MI for dodging the beast (at least for now), but isn't this backwards? Powers not granted specifically to Congress and the federal government are supposed to be reserved to the states in the first place.
     
  17. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    Meanwhile at Missouri's Lake of the Ozarks people who have owned their homes for decades with valid title under state law are being told by the feds that their homes have to be moved. Properties worth 6 figures are now worth zilch:


    These runaway federal agencies HAVE to be reigned in.
     
    Elizabeth Conley and nachtnebel like this.
  18. nachtnebel

    nachtnebel Original Member

    This is like the Friant dam closure near Fresno, where, after 70 years, they decided they wanted the san joaquin river to start further south, resulting in economic devastion of many communities, 60% unemployment, and the loss of some of the most fertile farmland in the state. ONE guy, one clown in a black robe did this, to many thousands of people for the benefit of NO ONE.
     
    Elizabeth Conley likes this.
  19. Elizabeth Conley

    Elizabeth Conley Original Member

    This decision automatically confiscates 300-750 thousand dollars from these families' net worth. This theft on the part of the Federal Government is unconscionable, and it's not the first time.

    Such a devastating financial blow will wipe out people's dreams of retirement and reduce many to poverty - for what?

    This administration cares not one bit for the financial well-being of ordinary Americans.
     
  20. KrazyKat

    KrazyKat Original Member

    :sigh: I try to work on the mitigations, solutions, not enforcement. Certainly not shake-downs. Not irrespective of the communities affected.

    I once was a true enviro regulatory believer, but have seen the harm done when that's all that's operational. There needs to be an incentive system, not a regulatory scheme that drives everything. But regs are a necessary evil as a backstop. Not everyone is a 'good actor.' As we've seen with the rest of the economy, when greed goes unfettered it creates havoc. Chemical company lobbyists help write many laws, so I'm sure that works for NJ. When speculation and big money is involved, it's almost always 'whatever you can get away with.' It's the small fry that get hurt every time. For bad guys, if they get caught, it's just the cost of doing business.

    There is considerable movement to broader, more regional, more flexible reg approaches ---(now I'm really sounding like a bureaucrat)--- even from the Federal gov. But these are some big battleships to turn.
    I would say this: Although for some it may be a chase for some pristine state of nature, analogous to chasing 'security', at least it involves more science than fiction. Not that it's any comfort to the above noted victims.
     

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