U.S. drones deeply unpopular around the world

Discussion in 'What's On Your Mind?' started by Lisa Simeone, Jun 14, 2012.

  1. nachtnebel

    nachtnebel Original Member

    I don't think anyone objects to using these things like helicopters used to be used, to track a person fleeing from police, for search and rescue and so forth. Those are reasonable uses of this tool. But what has changed the essence of the tool now is the staying power. The nature of manned helicopters never let them be an issue wrt privacy and surveillance--too expensive for fishing expeditions and casual spying; they simply couldn't stay up long enough or unobtrusively enough. So the issue never came up due to the technology limitations. Now, these limitations are gone and we have to face the issue: do we want a surveillance state where these things casually spy on anyone/everyone? Do we want to live in an increasingly Panopticon society where we are under surveillance as soon as we leave our houses, or perhaps even within our house?

    I agree with you that the surveillance state is going to be a crucial legal issue for some time to come.
     
  2. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    It crumbled in 1929, too.

    Please remind me again, who won World War II?
     
  3. nachtnebel

    nachtnebel Original Member

    Neither the economy nor the currency crumbled as they are threatening to do now. It was simply a price collapse in the stock market that should have been allowed to run its course. Prices should have been allowed to decline across the board. Instead, we got year after year of price props that prevented the necessary liquidation. (See America's Great Depression, by economist Murray Rothbard.) The dollar was then still backed by gold and silver, and so had increasing buying power; also a very large percentage of people worked on family farms, better able to ride out hard times.

    Perhaps the Americans can learn to work together to pull things out of the fire again, but having been burnt by their federal leaders, and burnt badly, there is no way the federal government retains the trust and power it has now. It is surely going to shoulder much of the blame. Unlike in the Depression, people will not look to the federals for solutions, it being bankrupt and perceived as the cause of our ills.
     
    Elizabeth Conley likes this.
  4. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    This keeps reminding me of NYC Mayor Bloomberg & Police Commissioner Kelly, who've already alluded to having their own air force.
     
    Elizabeth Conley likes this.
  5. RB

    RB Founding Member


    The problem is government cannot be trusted to put limits on itself. Once airborne the drone role will be escalated over time.
     
  6. Elizabeth Conley

    Elizabeth Conley Original Member

    I'm a very peaceful person, but I see trouble looming ahead. Yesterday I read that while crime is declining in most areas, in the 10 most dangerous cities in the U.S. the crime rate is increasing. We've all noticed that the police in those cities are behaving more and more like criminal organizations themselves. It's scum against scum in Detroit, Baltimore, D.C. and the like.

    Notice that when 1st Sgt Corrigan got out of jail he moved from D.C. into VA. That was simple common sense. Corrigan is a very pragmatic person. He may work in D.C., but he doesn't have to live there.

    We're going to see law-abiding citizens leaving the crime ridden areas in droves, and we're going to see those cities explode with mindless violence. The police will be as bad or worse than the supposed "criminals."

    Neighborhoods like mine, brimming with veterans, look peaceful on the surface, but each home has an average of 3 guns. A few days ago at sunset I sat out on my back deck reading. In the space of 45 minutes I heard 4 weapons discharge. Each was a single shot - that's all. They were at random intervals, and came from different directions and distances. The same was true in the last "good" neighborhood I lived in. If a citizen can get it done with one shot, no one reports the gunfire. There is one fruity broad on the corner who used to report everything and anything, and she's been labeled a nut by the local police. Everything she's ever reported has resulted in police being met with a united front of rolled eyes, thinly veiled impatience and absolutely no evidence of wrongdoing whatsoever. We only respond to multiple shots, screaming, cursing and carrying on. - something which has never happened anywhere I've ever lived. I don't think my neighbors would tolerate the incursions of any thugs, including lawless police. I pity the fool who tries to sell drugs to our kids, break into our houses or generally make a nuisance of himself. I'm confident drones would be shot down if they came into this neighborhood regularly. Hunting drones would be viewed as "good clean fun" by the vast majority of men and boys I interact with every day.

    The police state is going to fail on both fronts. Law abiding citizens won't tolerate them. Criminals will recognize them as kindred spirits and engage them in a war of escalating insanity. There are no winners in war, and in this asymmetrical conflict there can be no surrender ceremony, and therefor no victory. It will be the law abiding citizens who will end the war. They'll do it by simplifying the criminal code, instituting universal citizen review boards and reducing police funding.
     
    DeafBlonde and nachtnebel like this.
  7. Mike

    Mike Founding Member Coach

    I believe this scenario is called "Mexico", although the law-abiding citizens are a long way from winning.
     

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